How many want to try on their own first?

In your opinion, what percentage of people actively pursuing the satisfaction of a want/need will first try to satisfy that want/need on their own without involving a professional/salesperson in the decision(s) and why do you think that happens? -Community Mailbox

Because most people in my opinion are problem solvers or want to be.

Aloha... Tom -rattus58

I can only address your second question because I have no idea of percentages involved. Why do I think that happens? Take a look at the phrasing in your question. Notice you said "involving a professional/salesperson" rather than "seeking the aid of a professional/salesperson."

We do not look for others to "be involved", certainly not salespeople. We look for sources of solutions, be they commodities, products, services, ideas, or cures.

If a salesperson represents that source in the eyes of the prospect, then involvement is welcome. -Ace Coldiron

Why do people try on their own? With my profession and this being the internet age clients now have the ability to look the problem up on line and have a diagnosis available to them.

With home centers that can give them what they want or need now why not try?This concerns any service type companies that deall with business to consumers. -rich34232

Seeking information from alternate sources is not new to this technological or distribution age.

There was a time when the local pharmacist was often the first person to consult for medical advice and even diagnosis. A time when barbers performed tonsillectomies, and even treated minor wounds.

The home centers hardly "give them what they want or need". Area managers at the largest of these chains have been eliminated; clerks are so poorly trained they are unable to provide even the name of manufacturers (which is consistent with the home centers' unwillingness to reveal pertinent information.) Service is mostly subcontracted, not to individuals, but to other companies who THEN subcontact to others down the food chain. Try and get a service problem solved!

No--what the customers WANT is to maintain a degree of control and noninvolvement with people who seem to represent higher costs because of their involvement.

Sadly, part of this is a result of our own selling "profession" and the large segment who fail to gain the knowledge and expertise in the particular arena that they sell in. When you position yourself as one who DOES have those traits, and back it up--the clients will be there.

Imagine going to a plumbing supply house after experiencing serious and urgent plumbing issues, and being served by a newcomer who got the job because he "can sell anything to anybody" and whose last job was selling cookware at the county fair.

Maybe it's time we dropped the highly diluted term "sales professional" and started thinking about "professionals who sell."

One of the companies I own is a strategic advertising firm and I'm willing to sit with anyone and put my knowledge on display because that knowledge came from a relentless pursuit. Yet there are representatives out there selling advertising who never even address ROI, and probably could not provide an accurate definition of what advertising is. -Ace Coldiron

I would not disagree with the limited or no knowledge with home centers　but that was not the question. If the home owner comes home with the product from the home center or anywhere with whatever they perceived as wanted　they received it, even with their limited knowledge. The question did not ask if they receive more　discoveries of wants and needs. In the mind of the client they did receive their want. What is a want and need? The client needs a faucet and they pick one that they like isn’t that equal to their minds want, until they are shown more needs that lead to new discoveries of new wants. The question was not pointed to discovery of more needs. I must agree that quite often they do not come out of those places with the correct product to do the correct job and I can create a buyer’s remorse situation and often do with home centers purchases.
　
You are 100% correct the ability to gain knowledge was there in the past however today it is at their fingertips with very little effort. One of the most popular web sites is a medical website. I think it is web md or something like that.　The ease at gaining information today is a huge plus to the client in their mind.
　
With my profession to some degree we have　always had those　who want to control involvement of some sort. I have always been confronted　with　some client in my profession that seems to think it is easy and they can do it or it appears to be easy. Back in the 70’s they would come to my father’s supply house to gain that information to install. Today they can go to Kohler and look for the installation guide and print it out prior to deciding if they want to take this task on and complete with no outside help. I will always have a client no matter how much or less I charge for a part that can always buy it cheaper and make it known. I am not bothered by this and I accept that this can happen and give the exact reason why I should be doing this. Is it really that they do not want involvement or is it that they think they can save money or the attitude I am not paying someone to do what I can do? The reason I question the term involvement they do involve someone either at the home center, on line etc. I guess it would depend on the definition of involvement. I cannot disagree with your statement however I would add to it. You have a point with the lack of sales professionals selling.
　
　I am at a loss to understand what area managers of home centers　have to do with anything. They rarely know or can understand how to take care of problems concerning product knowledge　they are company managers managing the building and employees. This does go hand in hand with the lack of true professionals.
　
　I cannot agree with you more concerning the term of sales professionals. I call them; sales persons or sales people and do not include them as sales professionals. They are not sales professionals. In my book I refer to a sales professional as a sales technician and give my reasons for that. That is a different topic all together.

Your last statement proves the lack of professionalism and provides you with a distinct advantage over your competition and the lay person that is indisputable. I respect and honor the professionalism you display with your clients.
　
-rich34232

Are you saying that a cookware salesman now hired by a plumbing supply house because he could anything to anyone is not professional? I'm thinking you are using the wrong analogy here, because a professional starts with attitude.

A professional, whether he's a weekend cookware salesman or not will maybe go though a learning process with his client, but he will do EVERYTHING he can to make sure that his client gets the right stuff for his job.

He may not know ROI, but he knows that there is more than just a leak to deal with and will do what he has to. I can tell you this, if this was me or my son thrust into that position, I'd have a plumber go out and evaluate the job and come back to me with an analysis if I couldn't do it myself. I might also send a carpenter out with him to deal with the modifications or repairs that will surely be required if the job is massive.

I personally feel that a salesman's attitude will always prevail if he is "professional" and that he will, for lack of a term, "do the right thing".

This of course is an opinion of one, shared by me and my resident personalities individually and together, sometimes in concert and many times not, opinions oft given with nary a thought.

Aloha.... :cool: -rattus58

Rich, with regard to my use of the term "involvement", clearly I was referring to involvement of salespeople in both of my posts.


My exact words were:

"We do not look for others to 'be involved', certainly not salespeople. We look for sources of solutions, be they commodities, products, services, ideas, or cures."

"...what the customers WANT is to maintain a degree of control and noninvolvement with people who seem to represent higher costs because of their involvement."

FYI the Community Mailbox is intended to prompt discussion related to given topics. The discussion is not limited to simple answers to the questions themselves. For instance in your first paragraph alone, you used tenses of want and/or need no less than eleven times and yet the original question used want only to describe a prospect's desire for autonomy in the buying process and not in regard to the solution sought.

I don't post with the intent of encountering restriction on what I say about a particular topic. And the only universe I draw my experience from is my own.


I do not think it would be too unreasonable to interpret the original question as:

How many want to try on their own first without INVOLVING a salesperson or professional?

I'll look for Community Mailbox to approve or disapprove that interpretation. -Ace Coldiron

I might start with attitude but it sure doesn't end there.

Selling skills alone, and you can include positive attributes like attitude also, are NOT enough to get a job done and done right.

The top sales people are specialists in their trade or field. If I buy insurance, I expect the salesperson to know insurance. If I buy a root canal from a dentist, I expect her to know a lot about teeth.

In my own case, I'm a professional of sales, but that is because I am very highly skilled in the art of selling. BUT--I am also a professional with oodles of knowledge of my own fields. Helluva advantage, BTW.

I could visit an insurance sales office or any one of a number of businesses that are not my specialty and help them strategize their selling efforts, but until such time that I had gained sufficient knowledge about the products and/or services, I would not be qualified to represent them with any assurance that the customer's real wants and needs would be met.

Interestingly, Zig Ziglar's claim to fame in sales was that of a cookware salesperson. I would prefer to buy plumbing services from Rich.

Mostly I disagree with your post.

Want to try an experiment, Tom?

I know you as having a great attitude, and you have a wonderful knowledge of sales. I buy advertising regularly myself---spend some decent bucks.

Sell me some advertising, Insurance Guy and Sales Professional. No crib sheets allowed. -Ace Coldiron

Sure thing Ace.... sn;

First thing, what market would you be wanting to address? Would you be wanting to address people at home, un-distracted by daily occurences or would you want to deal with specific markets while they are at work... like through a trade magazine or radio?

Are you trying to target companies who need help with sales strategies for their employees? How localized do you want to restrict your market? I know you have mentioned the term ROI, or return on investment, advertising can have an exponential return for you if done right, and by that I mean, if you target an industry, many times you can for very little more, target the hobbyist and multiply your return.

Tell me who is your current market? Who buys your products? Who else could buy your product? Of that market, do you know what your penetration is compared to your competition? How is your competition getting the word out? If they are effective at it with their strategy, we can't copy them, we have to make you different and notable, separate, not just another ad copy.

There are all kinds of ways to advertise Ace, so give me your market now and we'll come up with an effective strategy to get to the right people for you the first time around. This IS going to cost money and it is going to be effective, but ROI is going to depend on getting the best message out to the most people.

Question? How soon do you need this? Are you the guy making the FINAL decision on this or are the two of us going to have to present to another group or individual? If there is another individual involved, once i get a draft together for you, when can we present the ideas you and I come up with to them for their input?

When can we get together again to discuss the marketing draft?

Aloha... Tom -rattus58

First thing, what market would you be wanting to address?

I target the experience comparison buyer.

Would you be wanting to address people at home, un-distracted by daily occurences or would you want to deal with specific markets while they are at work... like through a trade magazine or radio?

What are your ideas on radio before we go any further? Then we'll discuss my market more. How do you feel about "live read" and using it for DRM? What has to be in place for that to work, based on your experience?

-Ace Coldiron

[deleted by poster -rattus58

I'm sorry, but I try and work with sources who know those concepts. I'm afraid we don't seem to be a good fit. I do want to compliment you on your attitude, however. I'll bet you're a darn good salesman. We just need someone to help us who has a little more savvy in advertising.

Miss Perrine will show you out.

-Ace Coldiron

deleted by poster -rattus58

[deleted by poster -rattus58

"In your opinion, what percentage of people actively pursuing the satisfaction of a want/need will first try to satisfy that want/need on their own without involving a professional/salesperson in the decision(s) and why do you think that happens"?

This ties the want and need to the original question.

Basically we agree I do not see the other parts being eluded to as an issue. -rich34232

Tom, this is not about "winning" because in this role play scenario (which was not intended to put you on the spot) there is nothing to win. Let's go back to the original topic which posed a question about "trying on their own first." In this experiment the buyer (me) would surely take charge of the facilitation over an alleged advertising salesperson who doesn't know DRM stands for direct response marketing and cannot focus directly on my stated interest in live read other than defining it.

I'm a great salesperson, but I would founder selling plumbing services. Yes--I have experience in what you do, but I'm not abreast of current information.

This particular subtopic started when I inferred that I prefer "professional who sells"--over "Sales Professional." I still do. You maintain professionalism starts with attitude. Fine---but it does NOT end there. You still have to know your stuff. A lot of people don't--attitude be damned. And as I originally said, that is one reason "many want to try on their own first." -Ace Coldiron