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WOW! Thoughts on this?

I had dinner with the owner of a manufacturing plant recently. He said that he believed that the sales training industry is about as authentic towards education as professional wrestling is to athletics.

Thoughts? - by Gary A Boye
Gary

Nice over the shoulder throw while slamming the body onto the mat statement.

Here is my observation and 2 cent worth towards the sales training in my industry The sales training that I have received in the trade service industry has been good but with no support. It has been very basic and after the 4 day or shorter classroom activity the trainer or sales training organization is never to be heard from again.

The past two years I have received numerous emails from a trainer that I had the privilege to attend his training over ten years ago. I wish it was an email asking me how I am doing and if I need any help but it is not. He is offering training at a discounted rate bypassing the companies that used to pay for training for their employees. Everything I have done in this industry has been one and done with no way to get back in touch to ask questions concerning the sales training taught. How can a company stand behind the training when the trainers are not reachable?

It has been rapid fire teaching and if you catch what is said then you will be able to use it however if you do not catch on your lost. If you were trained by another person you are told to forget that junk and do it my way instead of listening to your stuff and suggesting a way to combine theirs with someone else’s training. A training seminar in St Louis insisted that we forget everything we have heard in the past and proceeded to teach fear tactics to move people into a sale. When questioned he tried to use intimidation on the person asking questions about this tactic. A co-worker and I left after 2 days of the 4 day event to come home. The advice given to our owner; get rid of those guys they are a cancer. The idea was to paint a picture of absolute devastation in the home from flooding, dealing with your insurance company and having your home in disarray then asking quite simply do you want to wait until then or do it now. This is an easy way to get a person in a vehicle and turn dollars quickly. Not very educational in my mind.

I agree with your statement that I have read numerous times; people are self taught and I have found outside sources have helped grow my ability more so than the training I have received from the sales seminars. Reading Brian Tracy, Zig Ziglar ,Joe Girard ,Maxwell, Shiffman, Gitomer (to many to write and give credit to) and myriad of other writers helped me understand more than the actual sales training courses I have had in the past 20 years.

Now add sites like this and other sites that have allowed me to access some fantastic minds and ideas expanding my horizon. Outside teaching has influenced my perception and ability more than any of the organized sales training events that I have attended.

I attend and watch many webinars from different experts that also have enhanced my sales efforts along with helping me get my thoughts together learning more about running a business, tracking, dispatching and office. - by rich34232
I had dinner with the owner of a manufacturing plant recently. He said that he believed that the sales training industry is about as authentic towards education as professional wrestling is to athletics.

Thoughts?
I agree completely.

In fact, the conclusions sold to the public by The Sales Training Industry, are the antithesis to most recognized, scientifically valid cases studies, and researched principals of human behavior.

For me, at least wrestling and athletics share the characteristic of being both physical activities.

The Sales Training Industry offers very little quality thinking.

For me, this is why I enjoy salespractice. Here there are "real" experienced professionals sharing information that actually works.

The only way I could eventually succeed in sales was to reject standard training and start over. I did not have people like Gary and Jeff to help me. - by John Voris
I had dinner with the owner of a manufacturing plant recently. He said that he believed that the sales training industry is about as authentic towards education as professional wrestling is to athletics.

Thoughts?
Allow me to share two quotes which I believe provide some insight into my thoughts on education:
  • "If you can't explain it to a six year old, you don't understand it yourself."— Albert Einstein
  • "A Master teaches essence. When the essence is perceived, he teaches what is necessary to expand the perception." - Gary Zukav (The Dancing Wu Li Masters)
In my experience most, not all, of the sales training content (information and experiences) that I have encountered is lacking in those two respects. This is not a criticism but an observation. - by Jeff Blackwell
  • "A Master teaches essence. When the essence is perceived, he teaches what is necessary to expand the perception." - Gary Zukav (The Dancing Wu Li Masters)
I remember that statement from when I read that book. - by Gary A Boye
I remember that statement from when I read that book.
I too found that statement to be memorable. It has been a while since I read that book but it is on my list of materials to revisit. ;) - by Jeff Blackwell
Some of my mentors (including my father) wouldn't be where they are today without professional sales training. I think we should take everything with a grain of salt, but there's definitely an opportunity to learn all the time. - by salesandsales
Sales training has the same benefits as showering, do it regularly and you'll enjoy the benefits, so will the people around you. The better the quality the better the results.

Its the varying quality and lack of follow thru that effects the ongoing benefits to a sales person and their company, not sales training itself.

Like any high performing sports team they need to train continually to perform at their peak, even wrestlers... - by Tony Dunne
I remember that statement from when I read that book.
Gary,

This is an excellent quote. I will be looking into it.

Thanks. - by John Voris
I would like to defend the realm of sales training for a moment.

I'm fortunate to work as a sales trainer in an organisation where training is an on going process and not an event. I'm able to weekly or monthly (depending on client) offered continual support and long term development.

Repetition is the mother of success and if management and sales teams aren't continuing to implement the sales techniques or strategies taught by a trainer, training is always going to be ineffective and perceived the way that many of you above have posted.

Sales training will always see a positive spike in results for an organisation, however; without focus it falls by the wayside. This is no different to sales or industry compliance if there was no manager keeping the focus on their staff. - by MrCharisma
I would like to defend the realm of sales training for a moment.

I'm fortunate to work as a sales trainer in an organisation where training is an on going process and not an event. I'm able to weekly or monthly (depending on client) offered continual support and long term development.

Repetition is the mother of success and if management and sales teams aren't continuing to implement the sales techniques or strategies taught by a trainer, training is always going to be ineffective and perceived the way that many of you above have posted.

Sales training will always see a positive spike in results for an organisation, however; without focus it falls by the wayside. This is no different to sales or industry compliance if there was no manager keeping the focus on their staff.
I agree with all you said.

When I speak negatively about sales training, I make it a point to say, "The Sales Training Industry." These are the contemporary "Gurus" who are writing books and conducting seminars designed for mass consumption. In sales training, this type of "one size fits all" approach seldom works.

This has nothing to do with the individuals here at salespractice. I know I could learn very valuable training in sales principals and techniques from the seasoned sales people here.

You and many others, take the time with each trainee and help them through the process of sales training which takes time.

The distinction between individual training and diluted mass training is an important point to be made.

Thanks for offering your experienced perspective. - by John Voris
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This has nothing to do with the individuals here at salespractice. I know I could learn very valuable training in sales principals and techniques from the seasoned sales people here.
As someone who sees his career progressing as a sales trainer over a sales manager or a sales person, I appreciate and take on your thoughts and the ones above.

When I do move outside my company there is going to be perceptions like this so it's good to understand what sales managers believe about training.

Far too often sales trainers are a flash in the pan. They pump up their audience and don't give them ongoing tools.

Another challenge in training is that they are told by managers what needs their staff need to be trained on rather then speaking to their front line sales people. Far too often sales managers lose touch with their sales team and a trainers content isn't the most effective training. - by MrCharisma
Another challenge in training is that they are told by managers what needs their staff need to be trained on rather then speaking to their front line sales people. Far too often sales managers lose touch with their sales team and a trainers content isn't the most effective training.
That can't be allowed to happen. You can never be effective as a sales trainer unless management "buys in" 100 percent to the program you use. You're not on audition. The trainer has to take the leadership reins, and if that can't happen, the trainer needs to walk away.

I say that to you personally, because I believe you have the passion and willingness to teach what you really believe. The "progression" you refer to will only manifest in further Understanding as time goes by. Your understanding will emerge in inverse proportion to the amount of "knowledge" you accumulate which detracts you from what you really know inside. Quality, core beliefs, and an unwavering attitude to your core beliefs will distance you from the pretenders in what John calls "the industry." - by Gary A Boye
That can't be allowed to happen. You can never be effective as a sales trainer unless management "buys in" 100 percent to the program you use. You're not on audition. The trainer has to take the leadership reins, and if that can't happen, the trainer needs to walk away."
Would you agree that more effective training would be by spending time with the sales team? - by MrCharisma
Love the comment about the essence.
All the best training and techniques come to naught without the mindset.
Principles always comes before practice.

The worrying comment for me here was that each sales trainer says to forget what other trainers have said because it is rubbish. Now that really puts the student in a bind. Who do they believe ?

Personally, when coaching sales people I want to know where they are at and what they know (diagnosis) and try and add distinctions to that. Why throw out the baby with the bathwater ? - by Greg Woodley
Would you agree that more effective training would be by spending time with the sales team?
I don't understand your question because of how it's phrased. More than what?

Certainly I can't envision training a sales force in an absentee manner.

My point that you quoted above was about what could be described as a "united front", whereby management FULLY endorses the training and education being offered. - by Gary A Boye
I don't understand your question because of how it's phrased. More than what?
... then not spending time with the sales team.

My claim is that a trainer can tailor and relate the training to sales teams if they spend time with them in the field making calls or sales presentations rather then being give a brief by management on what is required.

Companies you have worked for may not be like this, however; I've encountered a hand full of clients where management is out of touch with their sales teams. - by MrCharisma
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