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#11
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| Bang on, Mitch!!
If you take this one step further, it speaks to how you can see sales crumbling: SRs > SM's > VP Sales > departments/companies! IP? Assets? These things are all 'nice to have's' but the only real value in a company is its people!
My sore point: how companies resist giving the search to recruiters? The sentiment that it costs too much absolutely ignores the lost opportunity of having the right SR in-the-patch early - vs - posting the job and interviewing the masses!
I'm expressing frustration here because it seems to be a sign of the times. My past life experience saw input to HR from the SM. HR then worked the recruiters and provided a short-list. It was sweet. (Maybe another reason why Xerox was SOOO successful.)
Now, however, the job boards claim to 'cut to the chase' and provide candidates. The reality of it is that you get THOUSANDS of responses to job postings. I've even retracted a posting, re-written it to be more specific (key talent areas REQ'D) only to get the same type of response. I've then retracted the posting, re-written with such phraseology as, "DO NOT REPLY IF YOU DON'T HAVE ...". Only to get the same type of response!!!!!
It's really quite pathetic because there is some talent out there but there is simply too much "noise".
The SM of today needs to be extremely introspective when writing a posting or job spec. Then, that needs to extend into the interviews. You need to be ruthless during the phone interview process. Then, you really need to open up the tough areas during the one-on-one's, "... tell me where you and I are going to have trouble...", "...when you sold systems, why didn't you sell-up to include services...", "...what really happened when you left company 'X' ...".
The SM of today needs to have the best possible people!
Good luck & Good selling!
Pat
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#12
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| Bang On
Bang on! I like that. We have a customer in England and she is teaching us new phrases and expressions to live by - that's fun.
"but the only real value in a company is its people!" -- Pat
That's the real heart of your post - then the specific examples you give. The more we strive for excellence in highly defined selectivity the less will failure and frustration get in the way of achievement and success.
Also "The SM of today needs to be extremely introspective when writing a posting or job spec" is something I've found to be most instructive and telling.
MitchM
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#13
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Yes Outsource, totally agree. That was what #4 in my previous post in this thread was supposed to mean, that there are those who should not have gotten into our industry in the first place!
This is not the profession for the clumsy, incompetent, useless or ineffective, otherwise known to have a lack of skill. If it is a knife we can sharpen it. If not, we are wasting our time.
Incredibly, there are those new age sales trainers who say that the failure rate is unacceptable and blame the "old way" of training, instead they ought to look at poor hiring as the number one cause of failure in our profession!
Of course, the "old way" could be to blame for poorly trained people if that way of training was inferior, which many have been throughout time.
The original way to learn sales was as an apprentice (mentoring). Even then there were those who thought the way the "new agers" do now and coached confusion. There were also those who truly mastered the art of selling and knew how to work to help prospects get what they need, want or desire and passed it on properly. If it were not for the latter there would not have been great books on selling at the turn of the 20th century and there were.
Research and technology have only reinforced what has been known for more than two millennium. You can disbelieve this if you want to but psychologists agree, people are pretty much the same as they were then. Technology changes but morality, social consciousness and individual core values are not very different at all, though they vary slightly with each person.
If they had spoken the same language, we could hop in a time machine and get on well with people who lived during the time of Christ.
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#14
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Well I believe that poor training and the lack of being driven to sell can affect a lot of salesman. I have see numberous salesman who just go through the paces hoping to just collect a check, when the ones who have to "feed their family" are running circles around them.
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#15
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Sales people fail usually because they are lazy or fail to take responsibility for their results... (They blame the weather, the economy or management.)
Who is responsibile for training... management or the salesperson? A salesperson with a burning desire to succeed will get their own training. They will persist. They will take the time to sell themselves on their products and on themself.
Salespeople usually fail because they don't belive in themself, their product, or do not do the neccessary actions required to meet their sale objectives. They focus on results instead of actions.
Practice, drill, rehearse. Be productive. Count on yourself to do what is right. Continuously improve your skills, actions, and attitudes. Respect others.
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#16
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Originally Posted by FollowUpMaster
Sales people fail usually because they are lazy or fail to take responsibility for their results... (They blame the weather, the economy or management.)
Who is responsibile for training... management or the salesperson? A salesperson with a burning desire to succeed will get their own training. They will persist. They will take the time to sell themselves on their products and on themself.
Salespeople usually fail because they don't belive in themself, their product, or do not do the neccessary actions required to meet their sale objectives. They focus on results instead of actions.
Practice, drill, rehearse. Be productive. Count on yourself to do what is right. Continuously improve your skills, actions, and attitudes. Respect others.
| All true. Excellent post FollowUpMaster. 
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#17
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Money maker - well stated!
FollowUpMaster - it is true, some companies think sales training is product knowledge. They themselves (the sales management) have never been properly trained so they have no idea of how to put in place a serious training initiative.
And, yes, the sales person can seek their own answers but, there are learning techniques that are not considered, either in a company with training or by an individual who attempts to get training information themselves.
If you turn to the Internet there are literally hundreds of websites with bad and fraudulent information about how we learn, which are deceiving. And there are an equal number of training sites with poor information about how to sell.
This is a double whammy. Today, popularity online and even best sellign books has more to do with an understanding of Internet marketing than having proven oneself as a great sales person who should be teaching others how to sell.
Heck, look at this forum, even here it is tough to get find good information, as there are those who think they know, sharing their opinions when they have never even been involved in B2B sales, let alone attain a lever of competence where they can say they are sales trainers.
But putting this argument aside ... Personal development, sales skill training, self belief, visualization, burning desire ... all of these things are part of the make up of a winner, you are bang on.
Those who come from the personal development skew their spiel toward desire and visualization - that is this is there everything else will fall into place, those who are top notch trainers beleive they can improve anyone in sales (and we can), but the truth is these things and the others must be part of one who is or will be a super achiever.
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#18
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Originally Posted by Gold Calling
Money maker - well stated!
FollowUpMaster - it is true, some companies think sales training is product knowledge. They themselves (the sales management) have never been properly trained so they have no idea of how to put in place a serious training initiative.
And, yes, the sales person can seek their own answers but, there are learning techniques that are not considered, either in a company with training or by an individual who attempts to get training information themselves.
If you turn to the Internet there are literally hundreds of websites with bad and fraudulent information about how we learn, which are deceiving. And there are an equal number of training sites with poor information about how to sell.
This is a double whammy. Today, popularity online and even best sellign books has more to do with an understanding of Internet marketing than having proven oneself as a great sales person who should be teaching others how to sell.
Heck, look at this forum, even here it is tough to get find good information, as there are those who think they know, sharing their opinions when they have never even been involved in B2B sales, let alone attain a lever of competence where they can say they are sales trainers.
But putting this argument aside ... Personal development, sales skill training, self belief, visualization, burning desire ... all of these things are part of the make up of a winner, you are bang on.
Those who come from the personal development skew their spiel toward desire and visualization - that is this is there everything else will fall into place, those who are top notch trainers beleive they can improve anyone in sales (and we can), but the truth is these things and the others must be part of one who is or will be a super achiever.
| Here is what I witnessed in my career, I authored the words below in a similar lesson; I copied and pasted it in to share.
A Salesperson's Heart & Mind Set will go through 3 stages to Maturity; Here they Are:
1) Doing it "TO" their customers: The beginning stage... They don't know any better, and they are focused on a paycheck. Career life is difficult, a lot of ups & downs. Works only with fresh "Ups" (or opportunities). This salesperson has very little sales skill, no repeat or referral clientelle; and zero follow-up skill.
2) Doing it "WITH" their customers: The 2nd stage. Decent sales skills (perhaps have read a few books on sales, and have been doing it for a little while). Still focused on a paycheck, but now wanting a higher paycheck. Still lots of up and downs, but now the swings are worse. Still focused on the "Sale of the Day". Works maily with appointments and fresh "Ups"; but very little or no repeat clientelle... This salesperson has the skills and wordtracks to help clients through the sales process; but deep down, the client knows their actions tell them that they are still working with a salesperson. This salesperson closes a good amount of sales, but every client knows (when they never hear from them again) that this person didn't care. Therfore, they never pass along their name; sadly because they usually don't remember their name.
3) Doing it "FOR" their customers: The final stage. Congratulations, you are finally a pro salesperson. You don't have ups & downs, in fact; time is what you are short on, not money. Every person you meet recognizes your professional glow, your "I Can" attitude. They probably are meeting with you because of somebody else's good experience they heard about (REFFERRAL) or because their entire family does business with you, and only you (REPEAT). You do not focus on the sale of the day; instead you focus on the new relationship of the day or the relationships you have been taking care of in the past. Sales skills are a thing of your past; in fact you can't remember your last "tough customer". Your clients take care of you, because you are their friend, not their salesperson.
One Question: What stage are you in? The only way to be a pro, is to CHOOSE TO BE. It is a heart and maindset to CARE MORE. Follow up is key. If you do not have a sytem in place that helps takes care of your customers long term; then get one. Your sales career is difficult because you are laking this one element. Trust me (it took me 8 years to learn this one)... How long will you procrastinate? The next time you have a hard day, or a puny paycheck; think about what you are doing to take care of your customers long term. If you don't believe me, then try this test. Pull out the name of a person who you helped with a mortgage, home, or whatever it is you sell; call them up and say "Hello ________ , this is __________ , I thought I'd give you a call to see how you are doing." Then be quiet. If they don't sound gleeful to hear your voice, and recognize immediately who you are; then you are failing them, your family, and yourself. They are not sending you refferrals, I guarantee it. And they will not be loyal to doing business with you the next time.
This may sound crazy, but it's true: People are looking for some magical words that will put customers into a trance-like state and make sign the order to buy. It doesn't exist. Whether business to business, or face to face; people like doing business with people they LIKE. Instead of working on that new close you heard of, try building a habit of complimenting people. Volunteer instead of knocking on another door. Take better care of the people who have already bought from you. Meditate for a half of an hour about how much you care about others, and focus on helping them MAKE THE RIGHT DECISION, regardless if it means a sale today or not. If the sale doesn't include future business, and a happy client then PASS ON IT. It is a bad sale, and you don't need it. Make sure your client gets more than they expected. These priciples, when applied; will insure your success. Focus on being a better person, and you will become a better salesperson. If your focus is only to improve your sales ability for your benefit; sadly, your customers, family, and co-workers will only take note of one thing: Your greed that has doomed you to failure without change. Practice putting other people first, and learn from your mistakes... there is where you'll find the road to success.
Tobias,
aka FollowUpMaster
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#19
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This thread is an example of the great discussions that take place on this forum. There are lots of great posts that cause one to think.
Here's my opinion:
Salespeople fail because they don't use the correct sales behaviors. That's the overarching reason for failure in our industry.
Attitudes don't make great salespeople, behaviors do. Attitudes do affect behavior, but a great attitude is a dead-end proposition unless that great attitude leads to the development and use of correct sales behaviors which will generate the desired results.
Great athletes are great because of their behaviors: they swing the bat the right way to get the desired result; they shoot the basketball the right way to get the desired result; they move their arms correctly to outswim the competition. They may or may not have great attitudes, but to be a great athlete, one simply must have the best athletic behaviors.
Let's take an imaginary group of people: One is a great attorney, one is a great accountant, on is a great oncologist, one is a great carpenter, and one is a great salesperson. They're all great because they have the requite behaviors to have achieved greatness. They may be wonderful people or obnoxious people, have great attitudes or crappy ones, be hard-working or lazy, but all of those traits are secondary to the behaviors they employ.
Take the oncologist. She might be a jerk. But if you cancer, you probably don't care as much about if she's a jerk as you do if she has used the proper behaviors (accurately diagnosing and treating your cancer). The same is true of your attorney. When you go to trial, you want him to have the behaviors that will cause him to win (such as, he made a correct analysis of the case, he selected the best strategy, argued the case in court to achieve the desired result, etc.), and you probably don't care so much about if he's a nice guy.
Even training and learning are secondary to the correct sales behaviors when determining sales success. I say that not because I don't believe in those things, because as a sales trainer, I passionately believe that salespeople can dramatically improve their skills to achieve the desired sales results.
But training and learning are only good for having an impact on behavior. If a training seminar is fun for the participants, well that's just swell, I'm sure everyone had a bang-up time. But if those trainees' participation in the seminar does one thing, it darn well better help them to improve their sales behavior, because improved sales behavior improves sales performance, whereas improved sales knowledge doesn't necessarily impact sales performance.
So behaviors are king in selling. Everything else is secondary.
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