Home > Personal Selling > Where do you draw the line?

Where do you draw the line?

Market segment is b2c selling cars and trucks to consumers. Where do you draw the line between helping people buy and selling? - by Community Mailbox
Market segment is b2c selling cars and trucks to consumers. Where do you draw the line between helping people buy and selling?
That's what good selling is all about ! Helping people meet their needs ! - by TonyB
You only sell something that you would sell to your mother! - by Connie Kadansky
Market segment is b2c selling cars and trucks to consumers. Where do you draw the line between helping people buy and selling?
The question you pose is 'very unclear'. What are you 'really asking"? - by Paulette Halpern
Market segment is b2c selling cars and trucks to consumers. Where do you draw the line between helping people buy and selling?
Do I understand your question as, you find a line between helping people buy and selling? I just would like to be certain I understand before I give you my thoughts. If my interpretation is correct, then read further, if not, I'll wait for your clarification.

IF you help people buy then you WILL be selling. If you do not want to help people buy, you could have some sales results but will likely leave more opportunities, in this sales scenario, on the trunk.

Successful selling IS about helping people buy. - by patweber
There is no lines; they're the same thing.

Skip - by Skip Anderson
Do I understand your question as, you find a line between helping people buy and selling?
Mark Joyner, bestselling author of Simpleology wrote this testimonial at Amazon for the book Selling Sucks: How to Stop Selling and Start Getting Prospects to Buy!

"Selling sucks, but making sales doesn't. Read Frank's book to learn the crucial difference that will almost certainly mean success or failure for your business in the new era of commerce."

Where do you draw the line between the two? - by Community Mailbox

Where do you draw the line between the two?
What is "the two?"

And i don't for a moment believe that Selling Sucks.

Skip - by Skip Anderson
Mark Joyner, bestselling author of Simpleology wrote this testimonial at Amazon for the book Selling Sucks: How to Stop Selling and Start Getting Prospects to Buy!

"Selling sucks, but making sales doesn't. Read Frank's book to learn the crucial difference that will almost certainly mean success or failure for your business in the new era of commerce."

Where do you draw the line between the two?
Thanks for the clarification!

Selling and making sales then is the two lines.

I think it's a play on words really. I went to read an excerpt of the book and Franks says early on, "... I just think you and I have different interpretations of the word sell. You probably think sell means "to make a sale." In my world, it's the word buy that actually means "to make a sale." ..."

Selling does have a bad connotation from the early days, likely back to the 1940s. However over the years it has and continues to change.

The difference is: focus on the customer. It always comes back to that foundation! Forget about a line and just focus on the customer. Help the customer buy and your selling will result in making more sales. It has to be that way. - by patweber
The two is helping people buy and selling. Where do you draw the line between helping people buy and selling? Sharon Drew Morgen put it this way, "Would you rather sell... or have someone buy?" - by Community Mailbox
Originally Posted by Unregistered Guest
"The two is helping people buy and selling. Where do you draw the line between helping people buy and selling? Sharon Drew Morgen put it this way, "Would you rather sell... or have someone buy?"


This is largely an exercise in semantics, imo. By definition, you can't sell unless someone buys. And you can't buy without buying from someone.

So, in my opinion, these two concepts are one in the same.

Skip - by Skip Anderson
This is largely an exercise in semantics, imo. By definition, you can't sell unless someone buys. And you can't buy without buying from someone.

So, in my opinion, these two concepts are one in the same.

Skip
If I don't give a hoot about the consumer and purposely use what I know to get them to buy my car or truck that is selling but it isn't helping someone buy. - by Community Mailbox
If I don't give a hoot about the consumer and purposely use what I know to get them to buy my car or truck that is selling but it isn't helping someone buy.
So it sounds like your real question is this:

"Should salespeople not give a hoot about the customer or should they give a hoot about the customer?" - by Skip Anderson
So it sounds like your real question is this:

"Should salespeople not give a hoot about the customer or should they give a hoot about the customer?"
That is not my question. My question is where do you draw the line between helping people buy and selling?

Gitomer says "People don't like to be sold, but they love to buy."

Sharon Drew Morgen asks "Would you rather sell... or have someone buy?"

Are these sales trainers playing word games or is there meaning in those words? Assuming there is meaning what is the difference and where do you draw the line between the two? - by Community Mailbox
That is not my question. My question is where do you draw the line between helping people buy and selling?

Gitomer says "People don't like to be sold, but they love to buy."

Sharon Drew Morgen asks "Would you rather sell... or have someone buy?"

Are these sales trainers playing word games or is there meaning in those words? Assuming there is meaning what is the difference and where do you draw the line between the two?
You sound like you want an answer? :dun

I agree with Skip that this is more semantics. Sell is corellative to buy, as one party buys what the other sells. Selling is NOT usually an exchange or barter, but usually includes money in an exchange.

I cannot speak for Gitomer and Morgen, however, I do know what I mean when I say things like this. Let's put sell and buy at opposite ends. Does that seem to fit for drawing a line with them? So, consider the sell and buy on a continuum:

All the way over on one side is SELL as in hard sell, sell off, sell out, sell short, sell a bill of goods - these are what make people feel like they are being sold (your Gitomer reference) except when things are on the part of the sell continuum where you have an idea that sells or something sells like hot cakes.

All the way over on the other side of this continuum is BUY: buy off, buy in, buy out, buy into, and when people want to buy - they buy it all up.

As a salesperson, where do you want the line to be on the continuum? For me, it's where my service or product sell like hot cakes and the prospect wants to buy it all up. It's where they meet in the middle using the continuum example.

Sell and buy in my example, would meet at sell what you have like hot cakes and let people buy it all up. You help someone buy because you know what they want and need and are able to sell it to them.

This is the meaning in my words, when I say, if you come from a position of helping the customer to buy, you can sell more effectively. Buying happens because of selling that is customer focused. I can't speak for Gitomer or Morgen although I suspect it is similar.

Is this at all helpful? - by patweber
That is not my question. My question is where do you draw the line between helping people buy and selling?

Gitomer says "People don't like to be sold, but they love to buy."

Sharon Drew Morgen asks "Would you rather sell... or have someone buy?"

Are these sales trainers playing word games or is there meaning in those words? Assuming there is meaning what is the difference and where do you draw the line between the two?
From my first post in this thread, I've said that they are the same thing. That's based upon my definition of selling. My definition of selling doesn't include the salesperson not caring about the prospect and it doesn't include taking advantage of the customer. So I believe customers love to have me sell to them, as should be the case of any top-quality salesperson, imo.

That's based upon my definitions.

If someone else wants to imply that "selling" is in some way negative, that's their right, but I don't agree with that point-of-view. Therefore, I don't agree that "customers love to buy and hate to be sold" because there's an unusual definition of selling that's the basis for a statement like that. Since I don't share that definition of selling, I disagree with that point-of-view. - by Skip Anderson
Mark Joyner, bestselling author of Simpleology wrote this testimonial at Amazon for the book Selling Sucks: How to Stop Selling and Start Getting Prospects to Buy!

"Selling sucks, but making sales doesn't. Read Frank's book to learn the crucial difference that will almost certainly mean success or failure for your business in the new era of commerce."

Where do you draw the line between the two?
I just read Skips answer later on here; his definition of selling not including not caring about the customer. My selling includes caring about the customer too. The thing that you cannot deny, what Joyner, Gitmore, Morgen and I factor in is, you cannot deny that customers have HAD experiences that have made them feel sold to. Hence the different variations and connotations of selling sucks. We know that customers bring those negative experiences with them and there is nothing a salesperson can do to erase them.

However, as a salesperson, when you focus on the customer and their needs, and not YOU are your needs, your selling will minimize those previous experience ill-feelings. It has to be that way because it comes from a position of caring about the customer more. Quite naturally by taking a customer focus, you are not just selling with all the negative connotations to you. You are indeed - selling with a customer focus.

I'm going to walk away from this horse. It wants to rest. I don't read that it is going another direction. - by patweber
Market segment is b2c selling cars and trucks to consumers. Where do you draw the line between helping people buy and selling?
"What" line and "Where" do you see it between the process of "buying" and selling?

My definition of Selling is simple: Someone acknowledges they have a problem/need and a willingness/readiness to solve that problem, and sees my product or service as the solution....and then pays an acceptable price.

My definition of Buying is simple: Someone acknowledges they have a problem/need and a willingness/readiness to solve that problem, and sees my product or service as the solution....and then pays an acceptable price.

So what exactly is the "why or what, behind your 'where' question?

Most salespeople present their solution to a prospective client very early, before understanding what is really behind the issue. - by Paulette Halpern
The thing that you cannot deny, what Joyner, Gitmore, Morgen and I factor in is, you cannot deny that customers have HAD experiences that have made them feel sold to.
Okay, I'm going to get a bit philosophical here (warning!):

I don't think we should say that customers "feel sold" because saying that is promoting this idea that what sales is is taking advantage of people or not listening to customers, etc.

I think we should instead say "we cannot deny that customers have had experiences that have made them feel taken advantage of or not listened to or where the salesperson put his/her own interests ahead of the prospects." - by Skip Anderson
That is not my question. My question is where do you draw the line between helping people buy and selling?

Gitomer says "People don't like to be sold, but they love to buy."

Sharon Drew Morgen asks "Would you rather sell... or have someone buy?"

Are these sales trainers playing word games or is there meaning in those words? Assuming there is meaning what is the difference and where do you draw the line between the two?
My definitions of buying and selling are exactly alike. But the words, "buying" and "selling", are action words or 'verbs'. Gitomer's phrase, relates to HOW someone feels when they buy.

People don't like to FEEL that they are been sold anything....too often people have experienced being pressured to buy something.

People often feel sales people will lie to them, just to make a sale, because in their past experiences that has happened to them.

Feelings rule in all people. I would rather help someone see HOW my product or service can help them, OVERCOME a problem they have, and fit within their budget, and GET the order....without having to worry at all about some form or "buyers remorse' to happen and the sale dissolve in the end. - by Paulette Halpern
Wow,
This was a fun Read!

Semantics has entered it's curious position.

In the past 50 years of Successful SELLING, (and that of my proteges), all I/we have done is SHOW people
SOLUTIONS to Problems they Expressed
wanting to solve.

And if do your JOB properly they Keep Coming Back,
some for the past 48 years.

SELLING is a Noble Profession (it is Caring for the Customer)
and I have NEVER had anyone express a negative feeling to being Shown the Answer.

Easy to do, if one Uses the TWO EARS more than the ONE MOUTH we were given by Our Creator - by cjbart
My view: these are sound bites created by sales trainers/speakers/authors designed to increase their own sales by drawing a stark (and unrealistic) contrast between stereotypical views of "old fashioned" selling and what people feel more comfortable with.

Great as soundbites.

As technical definitions worthy of detailed analysis? Worthless.

Almost no one here agrees with the definitions of selling and buying assumed by the quotes. So trying to get people to define where some imaginary line is between definitions they don't agree with? Not going anywhere fast.

My answer, if you forced me to say where the line is between these two stereotypes I don't agree with: there is no line. In the middle it's always awfully grey.

Ian - by ianbrodie
"People don't like to be sold but they like to buy" makes it look like being Sold is something someone does to you and Buying is something you do yourself. There is a difference or a line that can be crossed but man who wants cross that line? xerm; - by Iceman
"People don't like to be sold but they like to buy" makes it look like being Sold is something someone does to you and Buying is something you do yourself. There is a difference or a line that can be crossed but man who wants cross that line? xerm;
Yes, Iceman, I agree. It's easy to say "People don't like to be sold but they like to buy" but of course this statement depends upon your definition of "selling" and "buying". What if the buyer's agenda and the seller's agenda are precisely congruent? That would yield this statement as false. - by Skip Anderson
Yes, Iceman, I agree. It's easy to say "People don't like to be sold but they like to buy" but of course this statement depends upon your definition of "selling" and "buying". What if the buyer's agenda and the seller's agenda are precisely congruent? That would yield this statement as false.
Words get in the way. ;bg - by Iceman
you are selling when you are creating curiosity...when you are creating urgency and when you are making it easy for the customer to say yes by being likable, knowledgeable yet usually not tooo slick...

know product and know your industry even better....!! - by planrecruiter
Gitomer says "People don't like to be sold, but they love to buy."

Sharon Drew Morgen asks "Would you rather sell... or have someone buy?"

Are these sales trainers playing word games or is there meaning in those words? Assuming there is meaning what is the difference and where do you draw the line between the two?
Gitomer's quote is an often-used cliche he borrowed. Morgen's quote is a promotional line she uses.

Neither catagories--cliches or marketing slogans-- are ripe with tools to advance our skills and understanding. - by Ace Coldiron
There is no lines; they're the same thing.

Skip
From a practical standpoint, absolutely correct!

From a semantics viewpoint, fodder for endless discussion that won't put a dime in anybody's pocket. - by Ace Coldiron
The line is drawn when your integrity is comprised. - by Connie Kadansky
my take on the difference and where you draw the line. You always do it for the client once you start to do it to the client it is time to quit and start to introduce yourself to ethics,honesty and become trustworthy - by rich34232
Again question is very vague, but here is my take from what I understand.

Having someone buy is a very conservative approach, and therefor you make a very conservative comission. At a car dealership, you can probably sit at your desk, and have 3-4 people come up to you and buy a vehicle. They are the ones deciding what they want, and how much they want to pay. I call it being a waiter. Pretty much its "Hi sir, may I take your order?"

Selling is the complete opposite. It's said that the average consumer is more knowledgable today than they were 10 years ago. Yet a majority of the time the consumer doesn't know what he wants. Those of you in car sales have probably seen it, a customer comes in looking for a black 4x4 truck and won't take anything else, and leaves in a little 4 cylinder car. If you are selling rather than waiting for people to buy, you will build value in the product, and therefor probably maintain a higher gross making you more money.

Remember you were hired as a "sales" conultant, not a "buying" consultant. - by jrboyd
Weekly Updates!
Questions and Answers about Selling
Subscribe to our mailing list to get threads and posts sent to your email address weekly - Free of Charge.